Roy Stubbifield And Mailings To Delinquent Taxpayers
I recieved a call today from a woman in Texas who was urged by Stubbifield's group to invest in Missouri.
True to Stubbiefield's investment techniques the woman was asked to send hundreds of letters to individuals with tax delinquencies. She paid $5000 for a coach from Stubbifeild's group to help her through this process. According to her the 'coach' was not very helpful and did not give her the attention that a $5,000 investment in 'training' should provide. I have no idea of whether this is true or false.
Apparnetly the list she used was made up of individuals who had a tax delinquency BUT the lien on thier property had not been sold at a tax sale. In her letter she was asked to state that a 'property tax lien that had attached to your parcel has been sold at a tax sale'.
Her 'coach' did not verify the list. She sent 200 letters to individuals offering to buy thier properties. The delinquent taxpayers were very suprised to hear that tax lien on thier parcels had been sold. As a result they contacted the county tax office. The county tax office contacted the county attorney and the county attorney contacted the Attorney General for the state of Missouri.
She learned on Friday that she is being sued by the state of Missouri and damages sought are $1000 per person x 200 people = $200,000. [Edited by Darius M. Barazandeh ]on June 10th due to a typo] While it seems doubtful that the state will get that much since her mistake was not willfull or intentional.
Nevertheless she will pay court costs, a likely fine of about $5,000 to $20,000 and attorneys fees for herself and for the State of Missouri.
I am not sure where the ultimate liability rests here and it may be the case that Stubbifield's group made no error. Remember I have not heard from both sides. Nevertheless use caution whenever you decide to contact someone who has a tax delinquency and are attempting to obtain a quit claim deed.
Also use common sense when approaching some of 'these' so called coaching opportunities. If a well thought out real estate course for couple hundred dollars or less and some good old fashioned networking/research can't work for you then I don't know what will.
Best of Luck
Yeah I am pretty damn mad at some of the characters in this industry....
[ Edited by DariusBarazandeh on Date 06/08/2004 ] :evil: :evil:
[ Edited by DariusBarazandeh on Date 06/08/2004 ][ Edited by DariusBarazandeh on Date 06/10/2004 ]
The point of your note is great advise -- be very careful when contacting property owners regarding tax issues. Fully understand the legal requirements for notification of tax liens before sending anything out.
As a note -- your fine/judgement figures do not match up:
$100 * 200 = $20,000 not $200,000
In any case the potential fine is a sufficient warning to others...
Another reason to consider forming a sub-s corporation to POTENTIALLY limit the damages of liability...
GlennI,
You must remember attorney's usually think about billing the clients, Darius might have been thinking about billing a client $100 x 200 billable hours may equal $200K in attorney land with the "fudge factor equation" built in. LOL
But then again I don't know of any attorney who only charges $100 per hour.
However, very good post.
John $Cash$ Locke
I bought Stubblefield's program for $80 a couple of years back, and I like his letter writing idea, though you can discern enough from his website http://www.taxsales.com to figure it out yourself and save the 80 bucks. I don't know anything about the mentor program, I generally avoid them. Sounds like this one led to problems, and though I find it disturbing that a legitimate mentor would recommend illegal activity, there may be some finger-pointing and opportunism going on here. The fine and costs reminds us that we need to be ethical at all times. The idea of lying to tax-delinquent owners about tax liens being sold should seem like a legal challenge waiting to happen, and if true, it deserves punishment.
I've sent some letters to delinquent taxpayers--maybe 60 or so, with no results. I've chosen them as carefully as possible--out of town owners more than 4 years delinquent--but I think this method works best if you're focussing on over-hyped subdivisions or developments that may have sold to out of town speculators for whom they may have lost their luster. There aren't so many of them around here yet. If you remind them in your letter they MAY be able to take a tax loss on their property by selling you a QCD for, say, fifty bucks, that makes a sale look appealing, at least to the right owner at the right time. And even if one bites, you still need to do some title work to make sure you're not just wasting the fifty bucks and buying someone else's problems.
The secret to Stubblefield's method--and he tells you this--is numbers. The more you mail, the better your odds. Just like every other realm of this industry...persistence and work pays off. I've had better luck with "I buy houses!" ads and using the creative techniques discussed on this site. Would be fun to get a nice property for fifty bucks though, wouldn't it?![ Edited by loon on Date 06/10/2004 ]
Regarding a property for fifty bucks:
1) Unless there are pollution problems which can cause hundreds of thousands in liabilities
2) or liens worth more than the property itself
3) or deed restrictions which limit the uses of the property
4) or 100 other items that can be significant problems
My point: due dilligence is required otherwise you could be walking into a hornets nest that will make you very sad for a $50 investment...
Sorry about that it was a mistake in my typing.
The fine as described to me was $1000 for each of the 200 people who recieved a letter.